MBB Gameday Open Thread: Oregon vs. Missouri
by dvieira on Dec 5, 2009 1:57 PM PST
in Oregon Ducks Basketball
141 comments
Oregon Ducks at Missouri Tigers, Dec 5, 2009 2:00 PM PST
Who: Oregon Ducks (4-2, 0-0 Pac-10) vs. Missouri Tigers (4-2, 0-0 Big-12)
Time: 2:00pm PST
Location: Mizzou Arena, Columbia, Missouri
Media: ESPNU, Live Stats
Oregon travels to Missouri to take on the Tigers as part of the Big 12 / Pac-10 Hardwood Challenge. This should be a good measure on where this team is going to go this year. If we can at least hang with them, I'll feel a lot better about where this team is going. If we get blown out, ugh...don't want to think about it. Go Ducks!
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Starting Lineup
Ducks to start: 11-Malcolm Armstead, 24-LeKendric Longmire, 25-E.J. Singler, 32-Teondre Williams, 33-Michael Dunigan
How about EJ refusing the redshirt and playing into the starting lineup? I like it
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
listening to the radio broadcast, the crowd noise is nearly drowning out Jerry Allen. Its been a long time since I’ve heard Mac Court that loud
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
its not at Mac Court
unless you knew that and were just referring to the fact that we have sucked recently.
--Dave
Addicted to Quack, SBN's Oregon Ducks blog
yep, I knew that…unfortunately
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
ESPNU isn't showing the game because some 1-AA football game is going long
lame
--Dave
Addicted to Quack, SBN's Oregon Ducks blog
Oregon in green with yellow trim
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
steal by the Tigers already have Ducks get the tap. Bury a 3. 3-0 Mizzou
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
another turnover underneath by Armstead.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
too many offensive rebounds. Mizzou gets a bucket and a foul
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
6-0 lead by the tigers to start the game
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Oregon trying to catch up too quickly by jacking 3’s.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
We finally get a steal and miss a layup. Sound familiar? Losing early, missing layups? What does this sound like to you?
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Dunigan gets a bucket underneath. Ducks trail 6-2
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
teams starting to get a bit sloppy, turnovers by both teams
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Singer picks up a quick 2nd foul and will sit for Drew Willey next dead ball
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Media Timeout, Mizzou leads 6-2 after some good defensive stands. Under 16 minutes to play in the 1st half
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
TP and Wiley into the game
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Drew Wiley nails a long 3. 6-5 Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Mizzou responds with a 3. 9-5
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Tiller for Mizzou has 2 fouls and sits. He guards Dunigan
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Oregon shooting 25% for the field on 2 of 8 shooting. Jamil Wilson into the game
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
JJ comes in for Dunigan
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Oregon isn’t looking inside too much. Shooting a lot from outside 15 feet
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
11-5 Missouri after they run an inbounds play for a bucket
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Jamil Wilson gets his second foul quickly and goes to the bench
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Oregon can’t buy any baskets right now. Can’t get FG’s to go and inside shots are rolling off the rim
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
2 of 14 from the field. Absolutely horrible shooting to start the game
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
As soon as I say that, Sim nails a 3. 11-8 Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
11:54 to go in the first half. Despite the shooting woes, Oregon is still in it. Media Timeout. Missouri shooting 3 free throws after the break
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Missouri gets 1 of 3 free throws, Tigers up 12-8
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Tigers hit a 3 from the corner, 15-8
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Penetration and dish for Missouri. Lead balloons to 17-8. Timeout Oregon
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
out of the timeout, Oregon can’t get the ball into frontcourt. Turnover
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
2 free throws for the Tigers. 19-8 for the Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
another turnover for Oregon leads to a 3 point basket by Missouri. 22-8
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Armstead stops the bleeding temporarily hitting a shot. Ducks also get a turnover. 22-10
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
but Dunigan picks up an offensive foul. Gah…
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
rebounds killing Oregon right now. 24-10 Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Armstead with a layup, 24-12 Tigers. Ducks get the ball back
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Armstead is on fire. Hits a long 3. 24-15
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
layup by the tigers but Teondre Williams comes right back. 26-17
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
i'm really loving what armstead brings.
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
Singler gets the block on the Tiger break but they get the layup anyway. Then they get another basket in transition. 30-17. Timeout after some furious action.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
I love how only half of this game is going to be televised
I have a love/hate relationship with the Cardinals' middle relief corps. | Cards on Cards
3 point field goal percentage is creeping up but field goal percentage is still in the tank.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
TP travels with the ball. 6:04 remaining in the first half. Media Timeout.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Stat of the first half so far is field goal percentage. Oregon under 30%, Missouri at 55%
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
7 rebounds and 7 made field goals for the Ducks
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
I think Catron is still out
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Score?
Our collective lack of productivity has clearly paid off in the grandest of fashion. We are going to Pasadena. Yes, let that sink in. WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. To be honest, this has not yet hit me-WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. Wow.
Juju, We applaud your devotion and pure decency throughout the season.
the game is on now on ESPN U
here’s the justin tv link http://www.justin.tv/cbb2k8
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
Jay Williams doing color for ESPNU
man, I hate Duke as much as the next guy, but he is a sad story.
I have a love/hate relationship with the Cardinals' middle relief corps. | Cards on Cards
32-17 for the Tigers after a layup
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Agh,
That is not exactly promising
Our collective lack of productivity has clearly paid off in the grandest of fashion. We are going to Pasadena. Yes, let that sink in. WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. To be honest, this has not yet hit me-WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. Wow.
Juju, We applaud your devotion and pure decency throughout the season.
Josh Crittle will be checking into the game
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
33-17 Tigers after a free throw. Down low to Crittle who was fouled before he could jam it in
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
good ball movement through the press.
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
Catron and Humphrey are both out for this game and in Eugene
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Tigers hit another 3. 36-18 Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Does Juju not root for the Ducks in basketball?
He can run, he can pass, he is sicker than e-coli. Jeremiah always keeps things rolling.
juju is off till new years day
in case you didnt get the message
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
I missed that one.
He can run, he can pass, he is sicker than e-coli. Jeremiah always keeps things rolling.
by MarineCorpsDuck on Dec 5, 2009 2:44 PM PST up reply actions
Tigers hit another 3. 40-18 Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
This is not good. Not that good.
At least our Pac-10 record can’t get much worse from last year :(
Our collective lack of productivity has clearly paid off in the grandest of fashion. We are going to Pasadena. Yes, let that sink in. WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. To be honest, this has not yet hit me-WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. Wow.
Juju, We applaud your devotion and pure decency throughout the season.
The upside of this is that Missouri was a tournament team last year. If we end up losing this game by 8 or less, I’ll feel better
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
From the sounds of it,
That does not seem too likely…Sigh
Our collective lack of productivity has clearly paid off in the grandest of fashion. We are going to Pasadena. Yes, let that sink in. WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. To be honest, this has not yet hit me-WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. Wow.
Juju, We applaud your devotion and pure decency throughout the season.
maybe I should revise it to “losing this game by 28 or less”
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Missouri up over 61% from the field now
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
we need to make the extra pass and keep moving the ball instead of settling for 3s
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
well that looked like brady leaf.
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
3:58 remaining in the first half. Tigers up 40-18. I would say we need to prevent it from getting ugly but it’s already there
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
eh i'd rather have the win thursday and get blown out today than the other way around
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
Tigers hit ANOTHER 3. Ducks falling apart with turnovers. 45-18 Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
ANOTHER three. 48-18
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
the ducks can't break this press without TP at full speed
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
Crittle hits two free throws. 48-20 Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
those were nice form free throws too
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
Tigers barely miss another three. If they would have hit that, my head would have hit my laptop
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
mizzou 24 points directly off of turnovers.
nuff said.
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
Oregon gets one from the free throw line. Still way behind. 48-21
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
we know the team has the firepower
if they can cut it down and get some momentu…..sorry couldn’t keep a straight face through that post.
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
who made mizzous basket 3 happy?
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
1:52 in the half. English hits ANOTHER 3. 51-21 Tigers
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Longmire gets a tip in, 51-23
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Holy shit. I take a dump and we’re down by 30 now?
He can run, he can pass, he is sicker than e-coli. Jeremiah always keeps things rolling.
Missouri has just been hitting everything. 11 Ducks turnovers = 26 points for them
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
I'm just gonna guess
a team hits 9 3’s in a half… you may want to rethink the zone D
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
they’ve hit some unbelievable shots overall. Just ridiculous
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
21 seconds, Dunigan going to the line
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Dunigan gets 1 of 2 from the line
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
53-24 Tigers, shot clock is off
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Tigers turnover with 6 seconds before halftime
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Halftime score: 53-24 Tigers
Oregon had some open shots but just couldn’t knock anything down. Tigers over 60% from the field. 9 of 17 from 3 for Missouri
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Wow, sounds like an unlucky day to me.
allright, this is just a freak accident…
Our collective lack of productivity has clearly paid off in the grandest of fashion. We are going to Pasadena. Yes, let that sink in. WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. To be honest, this has not yet hit me-WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. Wow.
Juju, We applaud your devotion and pure decency throughout the season.
actually going to walk the dog. try not to walk into traffic...
Your official City Crow Of Eugene. Serving the community since 2009!
no kidding
53-24 halftime???? MBB need to figure this thing out quick. They are not looking very impressive early on with a lot guys returning from last year. Ernie’s going to be hearing the whispers here real soon if he doesn’t turn this around.
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
Missouri = very good team. They are also going nuts offensively this game. It’s one game, not the end of the world
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
I know, I’m really trying to keep a level head about this, but after last year with such a young team and a lot of guys returning, bringing in Dunlap, you would think things would be somewhat better than this. Loss to Portland (ok understandable) Loss to Montana (huh?) Oregon’s first real game against a solid tourney type opponenet, and they are getting killed by Mizzou
I have always like Kent. Still do, I just want a some consistency out of his players and teams.
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
Wow
did I see that right? Big is sweeping the Pac 10.
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
sorry Big 12
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
Oregon State beat Colorado so we got 1!
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
i've said it before and i'll keep saying it..
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
can we fire ernie yet?
look at what our football team is doing. we’re nike university and are building one of the nicest stadiums in the nation and we suck! its time for ernie to go. if it wasn’t for brooks we would have sucked the last four years. phil needs to offer mr mark few a large salary. i love my ducks! just my .02
by NICKPAPAGEORGIOTHEDUCK on Dec 5, 2009 6:23 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Mark Few didn’t want the job when Kilkenny talked to him about it in the offseason. Missouri is a very good, NCAA tournament team from last year that had a lot of key weaspons come back. Couple that with their lights out shooting against some good defense and they got early and fast. They converted almost all of our turnovers into points and that’s what very good teams do.
I hope no one actually thought we were going to win this game.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
irony
I hope no one actually thought we were going to win this game.
This statement is very true, but begs the question—isn’t that part of the problem?
--Dave
Addicted to Quack, SBN's Oregon Ducks blog
EXACTLY!
I hope no one actually thought we were going to win this game.
Why is it that we are playing a Big 12 middle of the pack team and we’re obviously not going to win? What has Oregon become when we have absolutely no chance whatsoever of winning a game against a middle of the pack Bid 12 team? I don’t know, I think I just expect more.
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
I expect Oregon to be able to keep it respectable.
I don’t ask much of my hoops team:
1. Have a reasonable chance of winning at home almost any time.
2. Don’t get stomped on the road by unranked teams that just lost to the Richmond Spiders.
I don’t think that’s too much to ask, given the resources available.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
This statement is very true, but begs the question—isn’t that part of the problem?
Responding to the whole thread
I’m being realistic in my expectations. Given our team last year, and the competition we’ve faced this year, it makes no sense to expect that we beat a good team in a good conference that went to the NCAA tournament last year. It isn’t like the problems of last year’s team have all magically gone away and suddenly we’re competing for a Pac-10 Championship. Am I happy that we lost, not at all. That being said, if you followed the team last year and even this year, you can’t say this wasn’t completely out of left field.
This is a team that’s still in rebuilding mode. We may still get to .500 but no one in their right mind was penciling in this game as a win. I certainly don’t like how we lost but given the context in which it happened (horrible record by Oregon, much the same personnel, same coaching staff, an opponent coming off an NCAA tournament bid), I don’t know how anyone can reasonably expect we would do well.
What has Oregon become when we have absolutely no chance whatsoever of winning a game against a middle of the pack Bid 12 team? I don’t know, I think I just expect more.
A team with slightly more experience than last year when they only won 8 games.
2. Don’t get stomped on the road by unranked teams that just lost to the Richmond Spiders
Unless your the elite of the elite, you are going to lose games that you shouldn’t lose and Missouri is no exception to that case. Every year when they do the tournament, they look at the schedules and pick “good wins” and “bad losses” when they talk tournament.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Dom, I hope you don’t get me wrong. I love Oregon, and I do not want to be labeled negative by any means. And in all honesty, this is not about Ernie or wanting him gone. But, I think we need to take a hard look at the program, with as little bias as we can and realize that we are in a downward spiral.
Can Ernie and this team pull out of it? Sure, bigger changes have occurred. But will I willingly sit by and be satisfied with the product (and only the product, not the men or the kids involved only the product) that is being displayed? Not at all.
Oregon fans, Oregon boosters, and most importantly Oregon players deserve better. And the fact that:
a) other programs are making bigger leaps than Oregon’s this year, with either less talent or less recognition than Oregon; and
b) some of the most diehard fans are already conceding losses to team we should be at least competitive with when Oregon gets blown out
is somewhat disconcerting. How long before Mac Court turns into a morgue and the program needs an even bigger shock to get up and running again? How long before, fans and boosters and recruits say, no thanks, Oregon BB isn’t really that good, I’ll look elsewhere? Is Ernie the solution? I don’t know. Rebuilding in college BB does not take years with an established coach with McD all americans. Once again, I guess I just expect more. We’ll see.
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
Not at all. I think the issue is that people over the years have looked very hard at the program and the whole Ernie Kent issue is extremely polarizing. The people that want him fired would generally want him fired regardless of how well we did because the argument would be “well, that was because of the talent, not his coaching” and “we should be doing this every year”.
My argument has always been “what makes us think we are at that point of being an elite powerhouse in basketball?” Yes, we’ve had a few good years but we are by no means there. Basketball has had facilities problems that are getting solved and as much as we like Mac Court, it doesn’t help get recruits. The Oregon basketball program under Ernie has gone in cycles and the expectation is that when the arena goes up that we have all the resources in place to make the transition to a consistent power in the conference. If it doesn’t work out, it doesn’t and we move on. PK mentioned those expectations just last year.
The other argument I make is that just because we have high expectations in football doesn’t mean we should have equally high expectations in basketball. If we are going to take a realistic look at the program, it needs to be in the context of that program. Not in the context of what football is doing.
As for what we are doing this year, we shouldn’t expect to go from an 8 win team to competing with NCAA Tournament teams. I’ve said before that if Ernie took us to the NCAA Tournament or even the NIT, he should be labeled as the NCAA Coach of the Year because with our RPI, that would have to be upwards of a 10 game turnaround.
I don’t have all the answers but I do know my baseline. 12-14 wins shows improvement from last year and shows that we can win going into the new arena. If we can’t at least do that, then it just isn’t getting the job done and I will advocate change. Until then however, I want the team to grow and Ernie’s the coach. His success is our success
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
I agree that Ernie is and always will be a polarizing figure. And not to go into too much detail on him specifically, I think his recruiting job over the years (both at Oregon and St Marry’s) has been nothing short of spectacular. Also, comparing the BB to the FB program is naive and short sighted… totally separate IMO.
All that being said, what I think has been missing the most is consistent improvement and overall consistency with the play on the floor. That is not a new problem. Even in years where Oregon has made a good run in the Pac or NCAA tourney, consistency from Ernie’s team has been the weak spot.
To get to Elite status, you have to produce a consistent product and consistently show that you can take big name guys and make them great and no name guys and make them good. Ernie has done that, but not consistently. That is what I want most from his teams. I could list player after player and team after team that either fell short of expectations or never achieved potential and I don’t expect this year to be any different (unfortunately).
Personally, I hope the that these guys pull thru and find a way to capitalize on what I believe is their potential (there are a lot of great guys and players on this team)… am I hopeful yes, am I confident it will happen??? that would take a pattern of results that have yet to be shown from Ernie.
I believe with the way the Pac is down this year a 4-6 spot in the league is potential, I’m just not confident from what I have seen and read so far that is possible… yet.
P.S. Oregon basketball is my first love, football is sexy and in the spotlight right now, but basketball has been and always will be the sport I like best. Dom, you are doing an awesome job covering this team, thanks for all your hard work.
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
I'm willing to settle for 12-14 wins... but not with this OOC schedule.
The non-league games are way too soft to say “12-14” is a respectable baseline. A team of potted geraniums could go 7-5 against this schedule.
The barometer should be conference wins. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect to win at least 8 games in conference every year. Maybe I’m unreasonable, but that’s me.
In any case, I’m having a hard time seeing 6 wins in conference.. which would be what they’d need to do to get “12-14 wins.”
Of course I will be cheering them on. I HOPE they get 14 wins. I just don’t see it. And I’ve been saying that a lot lately.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
There's losing, and there's getting stomped like a narc at a biker rally.
Unless your the elite of the elite, you are going to lose games that you shouldn’t lose
I have no problem with them losing to Mizzou.
It’s the way this team gets its ass handed to them that bothers me.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
Nothing wrong with this team that can't be fixed.
All EK needs is more talented players, with heart, and someone else coaching them.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
hey you may be right. Everytime Ernie loses a game, people come out of the woodwork wanting his head. He beats a couple teams, they go away for awhile. I think expectations were made clear at the end of last season about the performance of the team and Ernie knows things have to improve. Will Mike Bellotti carry the same line that Kilkenny did on issues like this, who’s to say. What I do know is that if he only wins 10 games against a down conference like the Pac-10, you will most likely get your wish.
Until then, I’m hoping for success. If it doesn’t work out, so be it. If it does though, I’ll be happy for Ernie and the team (and myself). 12-14 wins is my baseline and I’m going to give him an opportunity to get there. Getting wrapped up in losses this early in the season does no good unless you thought we were going to the tournament.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Some of us have advocated a coaching change for years.
EK is an adequate game strategist and an above average recruiter, but he has a tendency to make his great players only good as often as he takes bad players and makes them better. He doesn’t lift his teams — he just seems to even them out.
Example: Consider the year after Brooks left. Returning that nucleus of Hairston, Taylor, Oguchi and Leunen.. a great shooter in Porter, and all I can remember about those two years is Champ bailing out and EK screaming at the top of his lungs.
One or two good seasons every four years shouldn’t be considered adequate. Romar has built a better program, in less time, than EK.
I’m afraid EK is the hoops equivalent of Rich Brooks… the school stays with him because of a combination of loyalty and fear of the unknown. The difference here is that unlike Brooks, who left as soon as he had reached his goal, I truly believe EK feels he has his dream job, and would be comfortable coaching here for another 20 years, regardless of his record. That would be great.. for him.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
the school stays with him because of a combination of loyalty and fear of the unknown.
Couldn’t disagree more. If this was the case, Bev Smith would still be there. If there is anything the Pat Kilkenny-era (and to some extent, the Bill Moos-era) taught us is that Oregon isn’t afraid to make a change if the change is in their best interest. Also, Ernie is almost 55 and he’s said that he isn’t going to be coaching forever, perhaps 5 more years at best. He’s not going to be the Joe Pa of basketball.
To address your Romar point, the University of Washington is a better job than Oregon’s is. It’s a better market with better facilities. We aren’t going to attract a top end coach to Oregon until after the new arena is complete and you have to figure that PK had that in mind when he was evaluating the season last year. Also, Romar isn’t without his faults. His teams finished 7th and 8th 2006-08 including a losing record before having a breakout season last year. BTW, Kent’s and Romar’s overall winning percentages are comparable (57% vs 58%)
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Be careful when you cherry-pick data.
Romar has had two losing seasons in 7, and only won fewer than 7 games in conference once — his first season, when he went 5-13. His teams finished 2nd in the conference 3 years running, and UW finished first last year.
Ernie — in 12 years — has exactly one finish of 2nd or bettter, when Freddy and the Lukes took the title. He’s finished 3rd twice, 4th once, and every other season has been no better than 5th out of 10.
Romar is 73-53 in conference over the last 7 seasons.
Ernie is 54-72 in conference over the same stretch… with a five-year head start at developing his “program.”
How about OOC? In 7 years, EK is 71-27; Romar, 71-28. Without adjusting for schedule strength (I’m assuming it balances out as similar for both teams but I could be wrong), it appears that both coaches have teams that perform adequately in the “preseason”.. and yet, Romar’s getting almost three more conference wins per year. How do you excuse that?
I’m not buying that UW is a “better job” than Oregon, not for a minute. Even if it was a better job, how do you explain the lousy coaches they had before Romar got there? Was it not a “better job” when Bob Bender was coaching? Lynn Nance? Andy Musso or Russo or whatever his name was?
Sure, Seattle’s a better media market. But it couldn’t keep Aaron Brooks in town.. or even Blair Rasmussen. 24-hour cable sports and the Internet has made it a small world.
By your argument, Gonzaga shouldn’t be any good. How do they do it? Think it’s easy to recruit to Spokane? No. Few doesn’t recruit to the weather or the location.. he recruits to the program.
In any case, when we go “Mac to Matt”, the facilities issue will fall off the board.
The location of a school isn’t nearly as relevant in hoops as in football.
And I’ve never said EK can’t recruit.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
so you advise me to be careful in cherry picking data then do the same by only including Romar’s time at Washington? We obviously have very different views about what the Oregon job is and how it’s perceived nationally. I go with what Pat Kilkenny and others have said about the difficulties of the position. You obviously disagree which is fine. I certainly think that the job can get there but it isn’t there yet. Our advantage in recruiting to this area has been facilities and Mac Court is an extreme disadvantage.
To answer your point about Gonzaga, have you seen their facilities? They have an AMAZING setup and I equate a lot of their success to the Boise State factor. Crappy conference, lots of build up to their few tough games and good coaching and players. Few can recruit to Gonzaga because of all of those things.
I think Ernie is a good coach but isn’t good at managing expectations. He lets people build up what the team is going to do, even adding to it himself and then doesn’t meet those raised expectations. When you do that enough, it won’t matter what your record is. Think Charlie Weis.
As far as Ernie Kent’s recruiting, I think he gets recruits that are good but need some time to grow into their roles. Ernie isn’t getting the OJ Mayos or the John Walls or the Kevin Loves of the world. Oregon really can’t compete for those guys.
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Good comparison..
with the only difference being that a Notre Dame head coach is always under a microscope. Without a tradition or recent experience of success, nobody outside a very focused support base gives a rip about Oregon Basketball, which is how the school can get away with keeping a below-average coach.
I think a comparison of the last seven years of both coaches’ resumes is more relevant than going over the entire career. If you don’t, that’s fine.
Next year, there will be no excuse possible for “facilities”. But new facilities won’t make EK a better coach, just — hopefully — a better recruiter.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
Repost - not sure where this went missing
I didn’t compare anyone to ND. I made a comparison between Ernie Kent and Charlie Weis, both being unable to successfully manage expectations. It’s a great comparison because both tried to set certain expectations (even though they probably knew better).
With regards to your comment about the last 7 years, if you are going to bag on me for using selective statistics, then deciding to only look at a certain sample set because it fits your arguement better is really no different. I used both coachs’ careers. You used smaller sets that change the results
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
by dvieira on Dec 6, 2009 2:02 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
it didn't.
Reply Fail seems to be epidemic around here.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
If you're going to compare coaches who are both in the league at the same time..
.. it’s unfair, not to mention irrelevant, to include the previous period where one of the coaches being compared wasn’t in the league.
The last seven years is the relevant period for this discussion — which coach has done a superior job, as coach of a Pac-10 team, during this period? You don’t like to go with all 7 years? Fine, pick the last two. Or five. Or three. Whatever.
To say that EK is somehow “about the same” as Romar by including the years he was in the league, and Romar was not in the league, is the definition of “looking at a certain sample set because it fits your argument better.”
The argument is who is the better Pac-10 coach, not who’s had the “better career”.
I give not a rats ass what these coaches did at St Marys or Pepperdine. I want Oregon to have a hoops team that competes for the conference title more often than not. And, with EK, it’s been more often not.
That’s my argument.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
ok, so you cherry pick arguments that casually negate Romar’s bad years at St. Louis and miss our 2001 Elite Eight run? Whatever man. You hate Ernie, you think he sucks, we get it but to come in here and claim I’m cherry picking stats when you are doing it to support your entire argument? I gave one stat about an overall winning percentage between the two coaches and you deem it not as relevant. That’s fine. There is nothing I’m going to say that will change your opinion and you aren’t going to change mine
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
weird, my previous post got deleted. If I still have it, I’ll repost since it really makes our discussion disjointed
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
gah – weird, my previous post got deleted. If I still have it, I’ll repost since it really makes our discussion disjointed without it
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Dude, hate is such a strong word.
I was at Oregon with Ernie, along with GB and the rest of them. We’re in roughly the same chronological cohort (he was two years ahead of me).
I just don’t like him as the coach of my alma mater.. an opinion to which I’m entitled, as you are to yours. And you’re right, we’re unlikely to convince each other of anything.
Why is it that any time someone expresses an opinion that isn’t blindly supportive of the way things are, someone always comes out with the “hater” theme?
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
I think Dom is pointing towards your "hate" of Ernie as a coach
not the person… Benz I agree with a lot of your points and I think Ernie is on his last leg as Oregon’s coach (facilities, tradition, and schedules are excuses “underachievers” use to explain why they didn’t achieve what they should. “Winners” take what they are given and make the most of it and more).
I will agree however, with Dom on the fact that Ernie allows expectations to build to irrational levels, some of this is the fans fault, but a lot of it has to do with the fact that Ernie brings in quality guys to the program and does not make the most of their talent. I think we as fans see other programs doing more with less (talent wise) and get caught up in what isn’t, instead of what is.
For example, I love basketball, I feel incredibly knowledgeable about basketball, and I cannot for a second tell you what Ernie’s system actually is. I look at other coaches and programs that build sustainable consistent programs and it starts with having a winning system and then recruiting players to fit that system. Not recruiting great talent and hoping to create a system that will utilize their talents collectively. It tends to be more hit and miss, which I believe adds to Ernie’s inconsistency.
Does all of this mean, he has to go? I don’t know, I will leave that decision to smarter people than I (good luck Belotti). I will say that I get frustrated by his inconsistent teams and their development, and until he or the Admin makes some changes we will have to deal with it.
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
Maybe, but the quote was "You hate Ernie"
Surely you can see how I might misinterpret that as actually meaning I hate Ernie.
Otherwise, you and I are in general agreement. EK doesn’t have a system, as far as I can tell, so it’s no surprise to me that you can’t divine it either.
As for dealing with it, we all do this in our way; I will concentrate on rooting against OAC.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
I will concentrate on rooting against OAC
I think that is what frustrates me the most. A coach from Brown comes into OAC and immediately overachieves due to the fact that his message is clear on how his system runs and what the players need to do to be successful.
Now opponents are able to key on Robinson’s system and take away it’s advantages and since he doesn’t have the talet (yet) they are struggling.
Yet, here we are with a guy like Malcolm Armstead. I love this kids game, but he literally looks lost out there. Is he a running point? Is he a point who sets up the offense and distributes, or is he a creating PG, who gets to the rim and finishes and puts pressure on the D from the top? I don’t know, he doesn’t know, and I honestly don’t think Ernie knows. Don’t get me started on Porter, Catron or Dunnigan, much less young guys like Crittle, Wilson or Humphrey…
I can see how Dom’s statement might denote that you personally hate Ernie, reading between blog comment lines is sometimes tough to do, I would probably just give him the benefit of the doubt.
Whether Ernie figures it out or continues to flounder, either way this season is going to be an interesting one to watch how it unfolds. You can root against OAC all you want, I’ll root against the fuskies to even things out. Deal?
I LaLove my Ducks. Best way to start a new decade imaginable... Oregon in the Rose Bowl January 1st!!!!!
Deal
Don’t get me worng, I’ll root for the Ducks, as I’ve been doing in going on six decades now.
But I look at this .. gathering of athletes in flashy uniforms .. and see nothing but a collection of players who probably looked pretty dominant in high school. I sure don’t see anything like a team, maybe because there is zero leadership on the team. Porter and Catron are never going to be team leaders. Catron, bless his heart, is just too soft to take command, and Porter’s too short.
And from what I’ve seen, the leadership sure isn’t coming from the sophomore class, unless they’re leading assaults on park waterfowl.
Maybe EK just hasn’t been lucky. He’s not intentionally recruiting players who lack leadership qualities. Usually, you try to get one of them in each class, two if you’re lucky. For whatever reason, he’s sure sevened out with this bunch. Sad.
PS — I reserve the right to root against the Fuskies as well.
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
The argument is who is the better Pac-10 coach, not who’s had the "better career".
Also, I didn’t realize we were even arguing this. You said Romar built a better program in less time then Ernie and I said that he wasn’t without his faults and provided some examples. Since when we were having this discussion about who was the better Pac-10 coach?
--Dominic, Addicted to Quack
Autzen Stadium is where great teams go to die." - J. Brady McCullough, The Michigan Daily.
Would you feel better if I started a new thread.. "Who's the better coach -- Kent or Romar?"
those who do not remember history should read my blog...
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