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Poll: Spread Offense in the NFL?

The Orlando Sentinal has a story up about Jon Gruden and what he is doing now that he has been ousted as coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Apparently he wants to learn the spread offense. Here's a quote:

Q: People are going to think you want a college job.

A: "No. It means I want to learn more football. I'm going to pick out two or three cool colleges that I think have great offenses. Great places. I want to go to Oregon. I want my son to go to Oregon football camp, and I want to learn what the Oregon Ducks are doing on offense. ... I want to go in there and try to be a guest coach. I want to go to Al Groh's camp in Virginia. I love the way Al Groh coaches that football team. I want to learn a little bit about Coach [Jim] Leavitt. I want to learn about the USF team. I think he has done a hell of a job, building it from scratch. I think that's one of the great stories in football, what he's done in 12 years there at USF."

So what do you think? Does the spread offense translate to the NFL? Could we see Chip (or others out there that are spread gurus) leave for NFL teams? Vote in the poll and leave your comments below.

Poll
Would a spread offensive system work in the NFL?
Yes
81 votes
No
49 votes
Only if JShufelt is trying to tackle you
20 votes

150 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs  |  Comment 24 comments |

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It's hard for me to say.

I’m so biased and in love with the spread system, but I also think that, realistically, NFL defenses are too damn fast, and spread QBs aren’t generally sturdy enough. Hate to be cliched, but the little spark plug guys like Jeremiah Masoli, no matter how durable, are just too tiny. And the taller, lankier guys like Dennis and Vince Young and Pat White, the jury’s still out on that type of build. Guys like Joey, Ben Roethlisberger, Joe Flacco… all too pocket passer types.

If it can be run by the right personnel and coaches, it could succeed. But NFL defenders get low, and go hard. Better have some strong knees.

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 8, 2009 4:59 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I also kind of like those bolded words.

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 8, 2009 5:00 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I have gone back and forth about this subject, I don't know, how many times with football fans

At this point, no, the spread run-option (similar to what Oregon, WVU, Michigan, among others) run would not work in the NFL. The big reasons, butthol touched on above (durability, size, etc). HOWEVER, the “SPREAD” is often too generalized. There are many different variations of the spread. As it is, the “spread” is just spreading out the defense by putting as many skill players out on the field as possible: a.k.a. only 5 offensive linemen, no tight end, either 5 WRs or 4 WR/1 RB, etc

There are types of the spread that are in the NFL, and it appears that it is becoming more popular. Example, fullbacks are rarely used in the NFL anymore. The west coast offense was revolutionary in that it go the ball in the hands of playmakers (like Jerry Rice) in short, quick passes, and let them do what they do. Essentially, that is what Oregon does, just out of a shotgun, and with a lot more pre-snap motion.

Basically, the spread can work in the NFL, and in many ways, is already there (see: Colts, Patriots). As long as sports as been around, there is a constant cycle that is constantly in motion. Offense evolves to beat a defense (see, triple option running moving to the spread offenses, etc) and when an offense has taken over a sport, then the defensive minds begin to game plan around that offense (i.e. you see defenses getting smaller and faster…Safeties are now linebackers, linebackers are now defensive ends). Before the early 2000s, when was the last time you saw a defensive end successfully fall back into passing coverage? Now, it is something that is as normal as the forward pass. Once defenses have found ways to stop it, then the offense begins its evolution again. Eventually, you will see this in the NFL, but it will be a few years down the road.

One thing that is interesting, if you look at the QB’s being recruited now, the top ones can usually run a sub 4.6 40. I don’t want to make this a racial thing, but you are seeing black QBs almost as often as white ones now, because of the use of their natural athletic abilities. Not saying every black QB can run a 4.4 40, or that all white QBs are slow, but when before have you seen this many black QBs? It’s due to the evolution of the offense. And eventually, there will be a breaking point in the NFL.

I support Takimoto in his effort to support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.

by The VD Special on Feb 8, 2009 5:25 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

RE: Paragraphs 3 and 4.

The spread is “already there” with the Colts and Patriots, but that’s more of an LSU-style Power Spread. Jon Gruden singing the praises of us and Virginia Tech lead me to believe he’s referring to the Chip Kelly/Rich Rodriguez run-first Finesse Spreads. I also do think that the Triple Option and misdirection stuff that we run here may simply not translate, as to say that as defenders and linebackers and D-ends mature, they become smarter, and make quicker reads, which is key to defending the zone read. Always being one step ahead on the reads made by the QB.

And I agree with what you said about New Age Quarterbacks*, and a good example of this is that I don’t even bother targeting white kids in NCAA 09 ;)

Kidding aside, it’s how the game as evolved. It’s how dual-threats have become literally the only threat. The “throw ball away” button on my 360 controller has never once been used. Rocket arms are huge threats for guys who have them, but for players who have good-not-great arms, but can improvise or make reads well, they have a redeeming quality in that.

*See this article for more detail… http://media.www.dailyemerald.com/media/storage/paper859/news/2004/09/17/Sports/New

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 8, 2009 8:12 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

but for players who have good-not-great arms, but can improvise or make reads well, they have a redeeming quality in that.

Dennis Dixon

And yes, I will refer to it as New Age Quarterbacks, or NAQ for short. And I think you’re right about Jon Gruden. My point was that the word “spread” gets tossed around so much and is so general that it can envelop (right word?) almost any offense. You could make the case that even Oregon State has evolved into its own version of “the spread” And honestly, what Oregon/RRod run is just a triple-option offense of shotgun. It really is no different from the old school triple-option, except that the 3rd option often times becomes a pass, rather than another runner (old school triple option: 1. Fullback 2. QB keeper 3. Pitch to running back; new age triple option (aka Chip Kelly offense) 1. Hand off to running back 2. QB keeper 3. Either pass or run some other version of an option, with a 2nd running back or WR)

I support Takimoto in his effort to support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.

by The VD Special on Feb 8, 2009 8:30 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Yes but...

The old school triple option, as seen again at Georgia Tech, is a much harder read for a QB, it also goes either vertical with a big slow bruiser, or horizontal until the QB finds a hole. For these such reasons, I don’t believe in the usage of the old school triple option.

The quarterback has to read the end and the backer coming off his frontside, over linemen, etc. It’s generally a harder read, provided he’s actually making a read and not just using a designed keeper with a red herring misdirection.

Out of the Split formation in the gun, the QB will often be offset with his two RBs, or RB and FB. This creates a downhill give for the passing first option, let’s call him, I don’t know, Blount! And the quarterback’s name is, hmmm, Masoli. And the 3rd option running back is… how about we call him JJ?

Masoli out of the gun with Blount to his right and behind him, and JJ kiddie corner to Blount. The snap, Blount runs in to take the carry. Masoli a. Gives it to Blount who has a head of steam going into the hapless D-tackle, or b. Keeps it, runs out towards the corner with JJ trailing him, a linebacker closing in, then pitches it, JJ whips it upfield for 13 yards and a First Down, or c. He keeps it, stretches the play out to hash, sees hesitation on the corner, then cuts it upfield for a 66 yard TD.

With the old school triple option, everything’s way different. It’s effective, but I feel like the new-age triple option has fleshed out the possibilities of the option.

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 8, 2009 8:46 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

All those options you gave

Sound eerily similar to a game I saw earlier this year… One that I didn’t particularly enjoy…

I support Takimoto in his effort to support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.

by The VD Special on Feb 8, 2009 8:51 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

What, do you think I went into such detail... for fun? ;)

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 8, 2009 8:52 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm undecided.

But for the record, I voted no.

I just think the defensive speed on most NFL teams would negate the spread – as run by Oregon, West Virginia, Utah. Like the Wildcat plays we saw this season, elements of the spread will find their way to the NFL fields more and more, to VD’s point, that’s the natural process of evolution.

It will become more than simply a “gadget”, but I can’t imagine an NFL team adopting a true full-time spread offense where the QB may carry the ball 15 times a game. If that was going to happen – and/or be successful – in the NFL, the more classic Nebraska/Oklahoma wishbone or triple option might been adopted years ago.

Make me a bicycle, clown!

by JConant on Feb 8, 2009 8:19 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I feel like the Wildcat is the flavor of the month.

The new car smell lasted surprisingly long though, it seems.

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 8, 2009 8:50 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Is your sig from Wedding Crashers?

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 8, 2009 8:58 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Whatever funny man, just make it.

Make me a bicycle, clown!

by JConant on Feb 9, 2009 8:57 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I think if there is any transition of a spread option offense in the NFL, it will start more of the QB making a read to hand it off, or to sit in the pocket and throw.

It won’t be a QB keeper.

It's spelled "S-H-U-G-S-D-E-A-D-H-Y-D-R-O-S"

by JShufelt on Feb 9, 2009 8:15 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree

I believe most NFL defenses are faster and significantly more physical than those in college. And, there’s a big drop off in talent performance from the #1 QB to the #2 QB for most NFL teams. I don’t think many NFL would take that kind of risk with their top talent.

Elements of the spread that isolate specific defensive positions are too successful not to make it to the NFL. But that’s all I see of the spread at the NFL level – bits and pieces used by more progressive offensive coaches who are looking to expand their playbook and give defenses more to prepare for.

Make me a bicycle, clown!

by JConant on Feb 9, 2009 9:03 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

yes

because as effective as the spread offense has been in college, eventually every college team will be running it and scouting qb’s will become so hard that teams will just forget the whole process and switch to a spread so they can plug in any great athlete with at least a decent arm into their system to have offensive success. Also the spread makes it easier to develop a qb(see dennis dixon) so they don’t have to worry about finding the right qb more of just a qb.

"Howard, he know me" Rudy

by phillyduck23 on Feb 8, 2009 9:13 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I have to go with yes.

It would take the right personnel though. Either a beast of a QB that can take a beating (and still has an NFL caliber arm), or some one evasive enough (Vick, Dixon etc.) to avoid the worst of the damage. The nice thing about a well run read-option is that the QB is should only keep when the DE crashes hard. That means the QB should be into the 2nd level very quickly most of the time he keeps it. However, if the NFL DEs are disciplined enough to hold contain instead of crashing, the QB will never wind up keeping the ball, so could wind up looking like a belly hand-off out of the shotgun. But, that still allows another blocker to help out on RB side of the play (since nobody has to block the backside DE as he wouldn’t be pursuing).

by bpeterson on Feb 8, 2009 9:51 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Precisely.

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 8, 2009 9:53 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

KC Chiefs

My KC Chiefs ran a version of the spread with Tyler Thigpen and had some success with it. Tony G, D. Bowe, and Jamal Charles flourisher in the system. I think the spread is the next wave in the NFL, sort of like how the West Coast offense swept through the league a few years back.

by ArrowDread on Feb 9, 2009 9:27 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

I really want Dixon

running the spread for KC. Hes just riding pine in Pittsburgh (although hes got a ring now)

by ArrowDread on Feb 9, 2009 9:28 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Pittsburgh has really liked him, and most guys think he’s the QB of the future, though Big Ben is still a young guy, and as long as he’s in Pittsburgh, Dixon won’t play (unless it’s mop up duty or due to injury). I’d expect him to be trade bait down the road.

It's spelled "S-H-U-G-S-D-E-A-D-H-Y-D-R-O-S"

by JShufelt on Feb 9, 2009 9:49 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I think Pittsburgh likes him, he will be used.

And I also think that Ben Roethlisberger, despite his youth, is due for another one of his severe vaginitis attacks that sits him for 8 weeks or something to start the year.

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 9, 2009 3:55 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Or he could

decide that he is cool enough to not wear a helmet while riding his motorcycle…we all know how that ended up… Keep in mind, that happened not long after the Steelers won Super Bowl XL.

May we hand you your taints on a silver platter...

by 071903 on Feb 9, 2009 6:28 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't even ride my bicycle without a helmet...

Addicted To Quack [dot] com; "In other news, Ropert was mauled by a velociraptor yesterday and sustained a life-threatening ACL injury and a pulled hamstring."

by qrsouther on Feb 9, 2009 7:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

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