Rose Bowl 2012: Something For Duck Fans To Calm The Panic
Use this medication only as needed. When you begin to feel panic, an increased heart rate, non-stop sweating, or an inability to fall asleep on January 1st, you may want to read this post. THESE ARE NOT BONRPLLZ AND SHOULD NOT BE USED AS SUCH. The medication consists of Wisconsin's defense relative to teams that have caused Oregon problems and the Badger's own bowl deficiencies.
I'm slightly confused as to why people are just assuming that Wisconsin is going to score over 30 points. I would say it's probable, but I would also say that Oregon could most likely hold them to fewer points than that. I'm not discrediting the Badger offense at all, but I think that saying Wisconsin is going to score 35+ because they're really really good is inaccurate. Example, people thought Auburn would score a ton and they didn't last year in the bowl game.
The advantage our offense has over their defense is miles better than the advantage their offense has over our defense. The Badger defense is not fast at all, especially on the edges, which is why whenever Wisconsin stacks the box their defensive backs have to give 10-12 yards cushion on the receivers. There is a huge speed difference and that kind of defensive fault creates deaths of a thousand wounds. Any team Oregon has played in the past that is slow can't keep up with Oregon for more than a quarter. To further illustrate this point, Wisconsin is 43rd in the nation, according to FEI in allowing 1st downs, and rank 49 in allowing explosive drives. They are also 64th in allowing methodical drives (drives that go 10 plays or more). Lastly, the odds of another defense being above average in the schedule Wisconsin has played to date is .273, or 93rd (meaning it's very likely a team could be above average on that schedule), while the schedule Wisconsin has yet to play (Oregon) ranks 12th in terms of an elite defense being above average in defensive efficiency.
Oregon ranks in the 20's or teens in the stats just mentioned, but rank second in an elite defense playing above average against their remaining schedule. This is not to say that Oregon and Wisconsin are close in how challenged they will be in facing their opponent, but that Oregon is much better suited to stop the Wisconsin offense than Wisconsin is to stop Oregon's offense.
Now in an isolated game there is a lot of variability, but when one looks at the teams Oregon got beat by in their losses where Oregon was "shut down" they were all elite and fast. Boise State in 2009 was an elite defense who Football Outsiders ranked as the 10th best in terms of defensive F/+. Ohio State had the fifth best F/+ defense and they had tons of speed. In 2010 Auburn had the 23rd ranked defense but also had Nick Fairley who went beast mode and was a part of a dominant offensive line. Against LSU, who most teams can't even run plays against, Oregon scored 27 points, out gained the Tigers on offense, and have the best defense in the country this year that includes a dominant line. Wisconsin has the 32nd defense but lacks a line with speed and doesn't get a big push at the line (a percentage of 3.7% compared to LSU's 19.6. LSU is miles better).
Oregon has been held to below average output in their last two bowl games against elite, fast defenses, but Wisconsin has also struggled to score points in bowl games. Last year in their Rose Bowl loss against TCU, Wisconsin was held to 19 points. The year before they beat 6-6 Miami but only scored 20 points. In 2008 Wisconsin lost to Florida State 42-13. All of those point totals were multiple scores below their season average.
Oregon has faced a power rushing attack twice this year and done well. The first was against LSU, and the Ducks were doing a great job of pursuing the football and holding LSU to only 2-4 yard gains. Oregon made a fair amount of stops, benefited from turnovers, and gave up only 10 offensive points to the Tigers in the first half. Once LSU benefited from consecutive turnovers and ran continually at an Oregon defense getting no rest then holes began to form (Wisconsin largely operates the same way. That's how they pulled away from Nebraska). The second team Oregon played that featured power running was Stanford, and they had an even better quarterback. The difference in speed on offense and defense was clear with Oregon having the advantage on both sides of the ball (like against Wisconsin). Oregon held Stanford to 129 yards rushing and only 3.7 yards per carry, way below the season average, and the defense made just enough stops and turnovers to blow the game open.
What I've illustrated is that bowl struggles are not unique to just Oregon but are also present in Wisconsin's bowl appearances. The defenses that have stopped Oregon are elite and Wisconsin is not. The defenses that beat Oregon are fast, and Wisconsin is definitely not. Oregon has stopped power attacks (although maybe not as great as Wisconsin's). Ultimately, Oregon's offense has a bigger advantage over the Badger defense than the Badger offense has over the Oregon defense.
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A colleague
And huge big10 follower Michigan grad tells me the Badgers are screwed due to the speed disadvantage and will lose by 4 touchdowns. If the ducks start well Wisconsin is toast.
by doomsdaymachine on Dec 28, 2011 6:25 PM PST via mobile reply actions
I think Oregon is going to win...
… But you guys have taken this speed argument to an absurd extreme. Everybody is slower than Oregon – that doesn’t mean much when the opponent is the 8th ranked defense originating from a conference that, let’s face it, was superior to the PAC from top to bottom excluding the Ducks. This notion that there is some huge advantage here that you didn’t have against the likes of Cal or USC doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.
Either way, I expect a well contested game in the 25-23 range with Oregon, sadly, prevailing. Good luck Duckers
Damn, my eyeball tastes good.
@chrislandon
While many Ducks may be taking the speed thing to ridiculous levels...
Can we please stop acting like Wisconsins “8th ranked defense” means anything? They have played a schedule that’s on par with Boise State.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
This just isn't a valid argument
According to team rankings dot com, Wisconsin had the 29th strongest schedule in the nation, the Ducks were 24th. If Wisconsin’s stats need to be discounted, than so do Oregon’s.
As for the strength of the PAC this year (or any of the last three – we just aren’t as good as the B1G top to bottom. Even if you think USC is “back” (debatable if you look at games like the Minnesota one) it’s hard to argue that Stanford has actually had any legitimate OOC competition the last two years. As such, it’s hard to judge how strong teams other than Oregon really are. I’d put the ducks up against most, but the rest of our conference is down.
Damn, my eyeball tastes good.
@chrislandon
by Gekko Mojo on Dec 29, 2011 2:11 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
That’s fun that you pull one single ranking out of your ass for strength of schedule when just about every other ranking says otherwise. Wisconsin has had a very mediocre to weak schedule. Even more important, it’s wildly inflated their defensive stats, as kalon pointed out below. I’m not saying they are a crappy defense, I’m saying that just about every adjusted stat out there has them as an average to above-average defense.
I don’t really know how you can make that judgement about the Big 10. They have some serious weaknesses, which is why most conference rankings have the Pac-12 and Big 10 about even. The conference has some padded win totals due to their out of conference scheduling. Pac-12 has a significantly better top 3, Big 10 wins probably the next few matchups, then…Pac-12 may have a bit more bottom tier depth, but who really cares at that point.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
Superior from top to bottom?
What three teams from the Big-10 would you take over Stanford and USC? Good luck with that.
And yes, they have a highly ranked defense when you ignore things like who they played. They also allowed Ohio State to score 33 on them. You might recall Ohio State not being the most explosive offense in the land. Same with Michigan State. In fact, if you look at the offenses they played, they had the 90th-hardest schedule for their defense. Huh…shocking that they ended up pretty good, huh?
The speed thing is not going to be as big a deal as the execution thing, but the notion that Wisconsin has some superior defense is patently absurd.
Patently!
Damn, my eyeball tastes good.
@chrislandon
by Gekko Mojo on Dec 29, 2011 2:12 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I'M STILL PANICKING AND NOTHING YOU SAY CAN STOP ME!!
"It’s great with these group of guys. There is no panic in them." --Chip Kelly, Clearly NOT talking about members of ATQ.
@jblair26
I would say it’s probable, but I would also say that Oregon could most likely hold them to fewer points than that.
So its probable that Wisconsin will score 30+, but most likely Oregon will hold them to less than 30? I’m confused.
I think our defense will fine and hold them to 21 or fewer UNLESS the offense is stagnant and keep going 3 and out to start the game and/or turns the ball over
yeah, could've been clearer
i meant both are around equally probable, but more probable to happen is oregon holding them under 30.
In case anybody's watching the Holiday Bowl
Cal really sucks!!!
We're on the quack fix open thread.
Oregon loves you, Chip Kelly!
by gamedaytribe on Dec 28, 2011 8:21 PM PST up reply actions
I'm still panicing too. Especially after I read Fishduck's analysis.
Oregon loves you, Chip Kelly!
I just want to win.
This weekend I could see the Giants beat the Cowboys to get into the playoffs and the Ducks whip the Badgers to win the Rose Bowl. TBH, I’d rather take the latter and that’s saying a lot if you knew the admittedly immature devotion I have to the NY Giants.
The last few bowl games have taught me to not expect anything because my expectations have proven to be wrong. However, I was just thinking pretty much this same thing. Wisconsin’s offense plays into Alliotti’s schemes quite well. We will sell out to stop the run and will make Russel Wilson beat us. This is what we did against Ohio State, and Terrelle Pryor beat us, but barely. I’m not ready to predict a win for our Ducks, because Ive watched our offense take 1 or 2 quarters to wake up too many times now to expect anything else. However, if we get into a groove on offense early, it will force Wisconsin to throw the ball and abandon the run. If that happens, we could win big.
Just FYI
Wisconsin has never abandoned the run when they’re down. Not against MSU. Not against anyone. That being said, they don’t pass a ton period.
that’s a valid point, but we’ve seen some teams get desperate against us in a hurry (Stanford 2010 for example)
That's true
At the same time they also came out of the gates swinging, and they had a balanced attack. Wisconsin’s attack is great but not hugely balanced. They are about the run, first and foremost.
It’s like saying that if we go down early we’d give up the run. We wouldn’t; it’s an integral part of our offense. They won’t shut that off unless it’s not working, and there’s very little chance that the run won’t work at least some of the time.
to also support this point
when down two scores to tcu last year they had the ball with 8 min left and scored their td with 40 sec left, incredibly run heavy drive
Last year's Auburn team did NOT have an elite defense by any stretch of the imagination
they had one extremely good defensive player, but as a unit, that team was DREADFUL in terms of scoring defense.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
Whatever holds the image of an angel IS an angel. The eyes are not the windows of the soul, they are the doors.
Yes, I am on twitter.
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 28, 2011 9:21 PM PST reply actions
In terms of +/-, Auburn may have been good
but in terms of scoring defense and yards allowed, last year’s Auburn team was far from the world beaters people made them out to be, ranking 53rd in scoring defense and 60th in total defense. Like it or not, this year’s Oregon team is 46th nationally in terms of scoring defense and 60th nationally. The scary part is that despite the results of Wisconsin’s games against Michigan State (where they allowed 36 and 39 points), the Badgers STILL rank 6th nationally in scoring defense and 8th nationally in yards allowed.
Author at Acme Packing Company, a Green Bay Packers blog, and Editor at BT Powerhouse, a Big Ten Basketball blog
Whatever holds the image of an angel IS an angel. The eyes are not the windows of the soul, they are the doors.
Yes, I am on twitter.
by OBrienSchofieldismyHero on Dec 28, 2011 9:28 PM PST up reply actions
So your point is that scoring defense and total defense can be misleading?
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
by jtlight on Dec 28, 2011 9:36 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
i realized they weren't top 10 but f/+ had them as good
but they were fast and had a dominant defensive line and superstar tackle that helped cover up the weaknesses in the secondary
The superstar tackle is really the key. That was a matchup that Oregon was particularly susceptible to, but we overlooked that going into the game. I don’t feel that Wisconsin has that same matchup advantage. In fact, Oregon has those matchup advantages.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
yeah, what fairley did i haven't seen anyone else do
he was fast enough to get to the mesh point and blow it up if he got read. it was like the 2-meter wide hole in the death star and fairley was the laser blast.
Much like Oregon and Wisconsin
Auburn wasn’t great on defense, but they were very good on rushing defense and standard downs (top 20 in both). Which is where oregon needs to do well on. Auburn’s weakness was their passing defense, which was quite frankly bad. It’s also Oregon’s weakness, so we didn’t exploit it that well.
Wisconsin is the opposite of Auburn in that respect; they’re good against the pass and on passing downs, but not good on rushing downs and not particularly great against the run. That’s a much better strength-on-weakness matchup for Oregon.
But DT threw for a ton of yards
and CK admits he should have gone to the passing game sooner. CK was stubborn.
"Before the snap, I had made up my mind I'm gonna jump the out." - Kenny Wheaton.
Nerves
Monday!!!!!!! I’m freaking out. Cheers to all the Ducks fanatics, LETS GO DUCKS!!

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