Losing Alonso Will Hurt and Really Jeopardizes the Defense
You really screwed things up Kiko. I had a comparative post for the defenses between 2010 and 2011 all set to put up after the Spring Game and my conclusion was going to be this coming year's defense will be better than the last year's defense.
Now I'm not so sure.
If you compare units you'll see that every unit would have been more talented and better prepared to run our defense than last year. The defensive backs lost Talmadge Jackson, but Cliff Harris 2011 will be better than Jackson 2010. All we would have needed was for Gildon, Hill, Mitchell, Patterson to be better than a 6 game Cliff Harris from 2010 (considering Gildon started the first 6 games last year). Boyett and Pleasant will both be improved, and Dargan and Scales will add depth to the DBs making the entire unit better than last year.
The defensive line will see the greatest improvement. Don't get me wrong, I loved, Rowe, Clark and Bair, but they were undersized or not fast enough to be elite at their position. Heimuli, Special K (Keliikipi), and Jordan are a dramatic improvement. We've seen that already in the spring practices. Some are concerned that Brandon Hanna would be able to step in and be just as effective as Rowe at the drop-end position. My contention is that Hanna would have been better suited to cover the flats because we won't be using the drop-end as much on the blitz with Jordan, Turner on the edges and Heimuli, Special K up the middle combined with the upgrade in speed the LBs provided.
But that brings us to the linebackers. We lost Matthews and Paysinger. Two talented and experienced guys that had produced every year for the Ducks. These guys transformed what Duck fans think about and expect from the LB position. Paysinger never really seemed comfortable with the WILL position being a converted WR. But his speed allowed him to stay with TEs and get to the edges. Too often though he'd get caught looking inside and had to rely on that speed to not get beat (watch the first half of the UT game). Michael Clay will be replacing him and is a junior with two full years of experience. Clay's fundamentals are exceptional. He reads the line and closes as well as any linebacker we have right now. He needed to work on his pass coverage skills, but with such a talented group of DBs behind him, my last concern was going to be whether or not our WILL was going to be able to cover the 3-7 yard passes and we'd lose to teams that way.
Kaddu will be improved at the SAM having played there all of last year and most of 2009. On top of that we have Boseko Lokombo right behind him on the depth chart with experience, and word out of spring practices was they were experimenting with moving Lokombo into the drop-end putting more speed on the field and using a more tradional 3-4 alignment (makes a lot of sense with Special K and Heimuli in the middle clogging things up).
Lastly, we were going to have a hungry, ready to prove himself MIKE in Kiko Alonso ready to lead that defense in the middle. The MIKE has been the most important position in New Aliotti's defense. He communicates the alignments, he reads the offensive fronts and he's the first to react to pass, rush, middle or outside. Alonso was going to be the main cog that turned the defensive wheel. He'd had such a promising Sophomore year playing in 12 games, accumulating 16 tackles as a reserve MIKE, and being one of Oregon's top special teams players. With a full year off rehabbing a knee injury and paying his dues for a DUII, my concerns with the defense were in Kiko's ability to lead the defense and the overall depth of our LBs.
With Alonso's indefinite suspension (and most likely long term loss of playing time) consider me even more worried now.
Take a look at our depth chart. Beside the LBs already mentioned we have Dewitt Stuckey (a senior who appeared in 7 games with 6 tackles all of last year) and Blake Thompson (another senior who appeared in 4 games and had 2 tackles) as our only other guys with experience. Everyone else on scholarship is a freshman, sophomore or redshirt freshman with no experience.
Unfortunately, I don't have an answer for you. We could move Kaddu over to MIKE (not ideal whatsoever) and start Lokombo to give us the most experienced LB corp. But that means Kaddu is going to have to learn all over again and it also takes away Lokombo from playing in that drop-end position. We could put Stuckey in the MIKE but we're relying on a senior with 14 games of total experience and 12 total tackles in his career (FYI, Jeff Maehl has more tackles in 2007 (14) than Stuckey does in his whole career) to lead this defensive front 7. On top of all that, we can't afford a single injury or we'll be relying on redshirt freshmen or incoming freshmen that have a month to learn a complex 4-3 hybrid zone blitz system.
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Trust
I agree with you in everything. Kiko screwed not only himself, but his team as well.
I think, however, that we have to trust in what the coaches will do to cover this loss. It’s much different and fortunate in a sense that he did this now as opposed to later – like a week before we play LSU.
For some people with this type of disease (if he is an alcoholic) it’s all just a matter of time before something bad happens.
I never want to see a college kid, athlete or not, mess up their life due to substance abuse.
"David Paulson dropped a ball one time just to see what it felt like. But he didn't like it so he decided not to do it again." -Mark Asper
But, but...
Maybe he’s NOT just an out of control alcoholic. Maybe there was some medical excuse that will get the charges reduced and get him reinstated.
Right? Right?
Umm, what?
I know. We’ll redshirt him next season!
"Dispatch yourself with the utmost precision, and proceed as far as your individual excellency will permit." - John McEwan
Options...
We could move Hanna back to MLB, and along with Stuckey hope everyone remains healthy.
Hanna is too valuable at the Rowe position.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
Agree it will hurt.
But I’m not sure that it will “jeopardize” the defense.
Fuck you, Juju. We'll do it ourselves.
by BigGreenWreckingMachine on May 4, 2011 10:47 AM PDT reply actions
This hurts, no doubt.
Let’s face it — LSU has one of the scariest defenses we’re going to see this year. (At least, I think it does.) If we’re going to win that game, I figured it would be on the backs of our own defense.
Watching the spring game made me relax quite a bit about that prospect. The defense — specifically, often Alonso — was great. Now, it’s back to PANIC.
"[Autzen Stadium's] steep concrete banks and closed ends turn a small but rabid crowd from WAC-sized cheering section into a horde of bees with megaphones capable of reaching 127 decibels of hatenoise." -Spencer Hall
I'm quite comfortable with our defense this year, as opposed to giddy with Alonso.
the D-Line has some mild depth issues, but those could be shored up depending on how the new-comers do. Not likely though so we’ll see.
the linebackers, even without alonso, are still very good. Kaddu and BoLo on the outside with Clay in the middle, and Stuckey/Wallace/Malone as the second unit.
secondary is beastly, and will be for years to come. We have 5 RS freshmen (Mathis, Mitchell, Hill, Scales, Dargan) and at least two of them project to see quality playing time this year. Cliff Harris and Boyett are pretty damn good too,
The "Bill Simmons" of ATQ
I would think...
moving Kaddu to WIL would be more natural transition in my estimation and Clay back to Mike since he backed up both positions. BoLo plays the Sam spot. I know nobody says Pleasant is going to move back but there is so much depth at DB and none at backer and he has a full 2 years in the system at the SAM spot. I say you roll the dice on one of the uber talented dbs and move Pleasant back.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
Again, any of these LB moves takes away putting Bolo in the drop-end position and taking advantage of our excellent speed. I think we went from being very flexible and having many options with the front 7 to pretty vanilla (still good, don’t get me wrong) overnight.
On top of all that, we better pray there are no injuries at the LB position. We have literally no depth of experience.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
Welp, the guys with no experience have to get it somewhere.
Our Acrobatics & Tumbling team can beat up your Acrobatics & Tumbling team.
Addicted to Quack, where Matt Daddy can't fall asleep unless a grown man in drag sings "Daisy Bell" to him.
I would have preferred that Wallace got to learn for 2 years behind Kiko and see some action instead of being relied upon right off the bat.
Here’s the deep end, hope you can swim kid.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
I don't think Chip Kelly recruits guys who don't want to see the field their first year.
It’ll limit the playbook, especially with a new MIKE LB, but I have faith in our players to rise to the challenge.
Our Acrobatics & Tumbling team can beat up your Acrobatics & Tumbling team.
Addicted to Quack, where Matt Daddy can't fall asleep unless a grown man in drag sings "Daisy Bell" to him.
The nice thing...
is we’re getting ready made guys now. It’s not like WALLACE will have to play the whole game. Hopefully Stuckey merits some time as well.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
Maybe it is too cliché, but Chip Kelly will put in the players who will give us the best chance to win.
That means if Wallace starts, then I’m comfortable with that. If Wallace isn’t ready, he won’t see the field as quickly.
It's spelled "S-H-U-F-E-L-T-N-O-B-O-D-Y"
We didn't know that until Darron Thomas won us the Stanford game.
Our Acrobatics & Tumbling team can beat up your Acrobatics & Tumbling team.
Addicted to Quack, where Matt Daddy can't fall asleep unless a grown man in drag sings "Daisy Bell" to him.
I don’t think you would have said Masoli didn’t give us the best chance to win over DT and Costa prior to last season’s start. And I don’t disagree with your take, that as of right now, losing Alonso is a huge blow to the defense.
But over the last three years, guys have always stepped up. When we lost Blount, LMJ stepped up in a huge way. Losing Masoli, DT came in with a great year. So I have faith that the coaching staff will work through this problem, come up with a solution and whatever that is, will turn out very well, if not better than having Alonso as the D-leader.
I don't appreciate your voice of reason in such a time of panic!!!!
I don’t disagree with you. I trust the coaching staff, but from a personnel stand point it hurts worse then all those other guys. We knew LMJ was talented, and he made the most of the opportunity. We all knew DT had skills and he’s stepped up big time.
Does that mean Stuckey can’t or doesn’t? I don’t know. I know it leaves us incredibly thin at that position and in that unit, and those were two things I was most concerned about to begin with.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
This is not addition by subtraction...
as was the case with Masoli. Kiko was just an idea. He was the big, power, fast and instinctual combination that we’ve been salivating since we bacame Duck fans. Masoli had flaws and we could see that his replacement could throw over the line with a litttle bit of trajectory. In any case, here’s to the slight chance that the events of last Sunday morning weren’t as bad as they seem.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
I don’t think you would have said Masoli didn’t give us the best chance to win over DT and Costa prior to last season’s start.
I did. I argued on here that Thomas gave us a better chance at a national title than Masoli did.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
He wasn't talking to you Jared! God, quit being so self-centered.
Our Acrobatics & Tumbling team can beat up your Acrobatics & Tumbling team.
Addicted to Quack, where Matt Daddy can't fall asleep unless a grown man in drag sings "Daisy Bell" to him.
God, quit being so self-centered.
I’m not sure it’s a good idea to talk to God like that.
"No one ever rises to low expectations." - Chip Kelly Head Coach at the Univ. of Oregon.
by SouthOfTheBorderDuck on May 5, 2011 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions
Don’t worry. I’m just fine. I have lots of experience.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
by jtlight on May 4, 2011 12:55 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
A lot of experience being a smartass? Yep.
Our Acrobatics & Tumbling team can beat up your Acrobatics & Tumbling team.
Addicted to Quack, where Matt Daddy can't fall asleep unless a grown man in drag sings "Daisy Bell" to him.
Backy McPatterson.
Patty McBackerson.
Backpatty McBackpatterson.
THAT'S RIGHT, Kenny Wheaton you did. You cut back into GREATNESS.
by HoodRiverDuck on May 4, 2011 4:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I think his point
Is more that Massoli was a known quantity. We didn’t know what we would get out of DT and half or more of us thought that Costa would/should win the job. Every year we enter the season with questions and since Chip has gotten here he’s done a terrific job of answering those questions. Remember the O-Line issues after Boise St. We had one of the best last year. Massoli was kicked and a player that most of us (not named jtlight) didn’t really even know of stepped up in a big way and is poised to be one of the best this year.
I predict that someone is going to step up out of the woodwork that no one here expects to and fill in in a big way. Be it Wallace, Clay or some walk on that everyone overlooks, some unknown quantity this year is going to step up and fill in. As long as Chip is running this organization I find it easier and easier to let go of the Panic switch and just let things play out. Since 2009 Oregon has lost four (4) games. I don’t know if we can do anything but trust this coaching staff.
Quack Quack Bitches!
That's a bit of hyperbole.
Guy hasn’t played a live snap in well over a year.
Fuck you, Juju. We'll do it ourselves.
by BigGreenWreckingMachine on May 4, 2011 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Moving Pleasant
Someone mentioned in the comments, but no one has said anything official, but what about moving Pleasant back to LB where he played for two years before switching to Rover. It seems we have too many talented DBs trying to split time while LB is taking a serious hit.
Any thoughts or chances of this happening?
Little to no chance.
Pleasant’s worked too hard to get where he’s at as a rover.
Our Acrobatics & Tumbling team can beat up your Acrobatics & Tumbling team.
Addicted to Quack, where Matt Daddy can't fall asleep unless a grown man in drag sings "Daisy Bell" to him.
I don't like that move at all
I know he could do it, and I’m sure he would if asked, but now your rotating guys in the LBs as well as in the secondary.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
It's really not rotating both units...
it’s just moving a 2nd team rover to 1st team. Pleasant knows the SAM spot. The only person rotating is KADDU I thought he’s gotten time at the WIL before anyway. It’s seem the best solution in my mind. However, I know jack squat, so there you have it.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
You’re moving a 2nd string guy up
Moving Pleasant to LB
Moving Clay to MIKE
Moving Kaddu to WILL
That’s a lot of shuffling even if guys have previous experience at those positions.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
Clay backed up the MIke
Pleasant is very familiar with the SAM.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
The only one learning a new spot...
is Kaddu at WIL. I believe he alredy got some time there as well. Also, Coleman and Malone played pretty well this spring, right? Here is to hoping that it works out. Dang you Kiko!
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
It won't happen.
There’s almost no chance that Pleasant will move. First off, he’s a far better rover than he was a linebacker. He was losing time to the young players in 2009, and he’s just a far better fit overall at rover.
While losing Alonso sucks, and our defense is definitely worse off, the coaching staff won’t radically change anything. They may rotate at bit more in the middle, but that’s about it. These are not people that will panic because something doesn’t go according to plan. We have a huge linebacking class coming in, and they’ll get shots at playing time. But drastic moves are not necessary.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
I am saying it's really not that radical...
Pleasant seemed highly productive at SAM and the coaches said they put him at ROVER not because he was pushed but to get all the best athletes on the field at once. Pleasant seemed MIA at Rover last year but maybe that was good thing.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
Futhermore,
I think it goes along the lines of the coaches philosophy of getting the best 11 on the field. Sorry, Stuckey is not one of our top 11. He is a redshirt senior that has earned virtually no playing time on a 25 man roster. Unless he really showed something in Spring than I think the coaches do something about it. I bet the first move is to get CLAY to MIKE.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
Pleasant seemed MIA at Rover last year but maybe that was good thing.
This wasn’t the case at all. His production increased with the move. He was a better rover than he ever was at LB. Moving him will hurt production in the secondary, and the impact at LB will not make that up in my mind.
The coaches are probably going to be doing something to make up for the weakness in the middle, but I really don’t think moving Pleasant will be part of that.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
He was a better rover than he ever was at LB.
Do the stats back that up? I remember feeling like Eddie Pleasant simply wasn’t as visible last year than when he was at LB.
Not that he wasn’t good. I just can understand how one might think his production did drop off, for he seemed so anonymous last year.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
I seem to recall that when our defense struggled last year, he was noticeably out of position (first quarter against Tennessee, first half against Stanford and USC). But our defense didn’t struggle much last year, so I think that speaks well of him.
He wasn’t a playmaker, but he seemed to be solid.
Defending maligned chants since 2009
I am rather certain that you are correct.
MIKE = Clay
WILL = Kaddu
SAM = Lokombo
A couple points here: I believe Clay was Mathews primary backup at MIKE in much of 2009 (I am positive he was for the Rose Bowl).
I also believe that Kaddu was playing WILL against Washington when he broke his foot, and was making plays all over the field. Can anyone confirm or deny these 2 points?
by NICKPAPAGEORGIOTHEDUCK on May 4, 2011 3:57 PM PDT up reply actions
I have confirmed them...
Clay definitely played at MIKE and I have vague memory of Kaddu at WILL.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
I wouldn’t say having 11 more tackles, and only 3 less TFL and 2.5 less sacks than at a LB position was MIA. People tend to remember the plays Pleasant looked beat on, just like most people feel concerned about Harris’ gambling because of the Arizona play. It’s not representative of the whole.
By most reports Pleasant was continuing to progress at the Rover this spring, and is getting better in his communication with the other DBs and understanding the position. To bail on that now and have him relearn his old position (with new guys around him then when he played there 2 years ago) is pretty radical.
No need to disrupt a second unit.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
We are all used to a lot of production at ROVER
with WARD. I would expect an increase from SAM to Rover in tackles. It’s actually not the times he was beat that stick out to me. It’s more that I remember bigger impact plays at SAM. I do remember him chasing down Poole though for what was touchdown saving tackle.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
Just didn't quite feel like Multipliceddie to me last year, but whatevs, GTFO.
Take a doo doo pie. I love you.
by Bill Musgrave on May 4, 2011 7:45 PM PDT up reply actions
Lyerla to the D-side?
I was really impressed with his three catches last Saturday, but we have plenty of talent to fill in a two TE set, if that’s the way CK chooses to go. Does anyone remember if Colt has a preference for offense or would he be OK with a supporting role at LB? Does anyone remember what kind of LB he played at Aloha? Obviously he’s not ready for MIKE (the playcaller) and may not be fast enough for WILL (the fastest) , but what about SAM (the stuffer)? He seems to have the size for it.
"WIN THE DAY!"
CK himself said Lyerla is best suited for the H back...
although Pellum really wants him. Maybe French will feel compelled to play on that side of the ball.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
We have a huge linebacking class coming in, as well as French possibly playing on defense. With Williams and White constantly battling injuries, chances are Lyerla is far more important on the offensive side of the ball.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
I think 1 of 2 things will happen with KO...
If this is just Kiko bring an immature idiot, it’s likely that he’s gone. Neither Chip – nor the team – have time to deal with crap like this.
If, however, we find out the a greater problem is involved, Kiko will have a chance to stay on board. That is to say, if he reveals that he has a serious problem, and it’s something he asks others to help him solve (perhaps alcoholism), then I think Chip keep him on the team, has him seek help, gives him a progression list to follow, and allows Kiko the chance to earn not just a healthy and functional life, but also a successful football life.
Again, if it’s proved that Kiko is just a jack ass who can’t hold his booze and follow rules, then he’s gone.
by DuckIt on May 4, 2011 12:55 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
I'm not angry with Alonso
I think this is a really sad story to hear. Clearly the kid worked hard and had the support of his coaches to get back on the field and work his way into the starting rotation. I think most people who had a similar experience (in regards to his arrest last year) would learn from it and go forward with a clear understanding of what it can cost them.
From the outside it looks a lot more like a young man with a serious problem, maybe even an addiction. I’ve personally seen some very intelligent people succumb to those issues, so I don’t think it’s fair to say “Why did you do that?” or call the guy an idiot. Maybe he is, but I think it’s just as likely that he has to deal with something much more serious than winning football games.
I hope the folks and system are able to help this kid get his issues figured out and under control. It could be much, much worse than a few semi-minor charges and missing out on football.
Well Bloody Hell
When faced with skeptical reports on our 2011 defense over the last several months, I have continuously chanted the following mantra:
“Matt Daddy says our defense is going to be juuussst fiiiine.”
WHAT THE HELL AM I SUPPOSED TO DO NOW? I am NOT fond of The Panic.
Sorry Daisy
Just had to share some of my frustration. I hope I didn’t upset you too much.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
That's okay
I think I can probably find a Xanax laying around in the linty back of a bathroom drawer. Everything is going to be juuuuuust fiiiiiine.
If you need more things to Panic about...
I occasionally think about the possibility of John Boyett declaring early for the Draft, meaning that in 2012 the Ducks are replacing all for starters in the Defensive Backfield.
Who needs normal sleep patterns?
by AcadianTraverse on May 5, 2011 4:17 AM PDT up reply actions
*four starters.
There ya go TQA8 sometimes I leave out the Us as well.
Who needs normal sleep patterns?
by AcadianTraverse on May 5, 2011 4:18 AM PDT up reply actions
So you don't only PANIC about things we have to worry about this fall
but you proactively PANIC about 2012 as well? Those are some fine multi-tasking skills you have there. You should probably meet my friend Xanax.
Wow
That really makes me wish that I actually had an Rx for Xanax. As a matter of fact, why don’t I have like 5 Rx’s for this kind of stuff? What the hell is wrong with my doctor What a quack!
With my luck
he’d choose this moment to get all “Real Doctor” and prescribe diet, exercise and yoga instead of really good happy drugs.
Wouldn't this also mean Cliff would have to declare early too.
Don’t assume he’s gonna declare. The kid needs to put on 20 lbs still to be drafted as high as he’s worth. I would think it only makes sense for him to stick around.
by NICKPAPAGEORGIOTHEDUCK on May 5, 2011 5:14 AM PDT up reply actions
It does.
I could see Cliff as our most “draftable player” if he has a big season. However, I’m obviously no expert when it comes to assessing the Ducks’ NFL caliber.
I hope Kelly can work the same magic he worked with LaMichael, or that Cliff has a similar set of values to LMJ, but I honestly can’t fault someone presented with the opportunity to earn upwards of $8m over 5 years (assuming a rookie pay scale and a late first round selection) over going to school for nothing.
Who needs normal sleep patterns?
by AcadianTraverse on May 5, 2011 8:06 AM PDT up reply actions
Cliff recently went 4th in a mock draft.
Cliff has been at Oregon for two offseasons, and he hasn’t gotten any bigger. Unless he goes Barry Bonds on us, he’s not going to be adding 20 pounds.
--AddictedToQuack, SBNation's Oregon Ducks blog
I really like Schrager's work, I've read him for years.
Though his only credentials in becoming FoxSports’ “Draft Expert” is that he watches the draft a lot.
In his final mock draft before the actual draft he had 4 Oregon players being drafted (Casey in the 4th; Maehl, Bair, and TJIII in the third). I think he has a thing for Oregon Football.
Who needs normal sleep patterns?
by AcadianTraverse on May 5, 2011 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions
Cliff is gone after next season
no doubt about that
--Dave
Addicted to Quack, your friendly, neighborhood Oregon Ducks blog
SI’s 2012 mock has Harris going 11th
--Dave
Addicted to Quack, your friendly, neighborhood Oregon Ducks blog
Unless he fucks up off the field and has to sit out a bunch this year.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
Huh?
Cause that’s happened pretty regularly with Cliff? What’s your point?
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
Does it have to happen regularly with someone?
Before we consider the possibility that we’re getting ahead of ourselves? Have we learned nothing from the past two years of behavioral problems in our program in that it’s kind of ridiculous to try and predict exactly how pretty a player will be sitting a year from now? This goes for any player on our team, so don’t take it too personal when I suggest that it’s not an absolute certainty that Cliff Harris will get drafted in the first round of next year’s draft.
What’s your point?
My point is that we can’t really take for granted that any of our stars will keep their heads out of trouble through the next year with the way things have gone in the past. Cliff Harris isn’t exactly known for his sparkling work ethic and clean nose. So pretending like there’s no precedent to suggest that he might again not see the playing time that his talent alone would imply seems silly to me.
I don’t think anyone has any doubt of Cliff Harris’ abilities on the field. But let’s not completely shut out the notion that he could do one stupid thing in the next nine months that could cost him a few games of playing time for one reason or another.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
Yet he's never gotten in trouble before
And when people have talked about LMJ going in the draft next year, I haven’t heard you say anything about “hoping he keeps his nose clean.” And he has more of a spotted past then Harris.
My point is that we can’t really take for granted that any of our stars will keep their heads out of trouble through the next year with the way things have gone in the past.
Sure, as a matter of fact let’s never talk about what players might look like next year because god knows with how our injury history has gone, there’s a chance they may not play due to an ACL or other major injury.
My question was what’s the point of bringing this up for this player at this time? You’re taking a kid that has never been in trouble (only rumored “out of favor” with the coaches) off the field and saying you hope he doesn’t fuck up. Seems like a little more than a stretch.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
You’re taking a kid that has never been in trouble
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
And what happened to those charges?
Again, never been in trouble
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
The felony charges were dropped but to the misdemeanor charges Harris plead no contest.
Come on Matt, you know this stuff.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
Yep (I also know what happened and why... and assuming it has some merit in his ability to stay out of trouble is stupid)
Again, what’s your point in bringing this up with this player? It just seems dumb to suggest that a kid that’s kept his nose clean with everything that has gone on since being at Oregon would risk being able to play at the next level so close to being able to do so.
Oh, we shouldn’t take our stars for granted?
Well our season will look good next year unless our O-line falls apart in big games, or LMJ gets into domestic trouble with his girlfriend, or doesn’t drive his own car, or DT goes joy riding with Pleasant or riding dirty with Masoli or that our WRs make disparaging comments about the coach on facebook, or no one goes to frat parties and finds a laptop and guitar they just can’t live without.
Yeah, that’s a reasonable perspective. So glad you brought it up.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
Yeah, that’s a reasonable perspective. So glad you brought it up.
Cool, good to know dissenting opinions that acknowledge our team’s recent history aren’t welcome when they’re talking about someone’s golden boy.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
Yeah
because if you had made the same dumb comment about LMJ or DT or anyone else I wouldn’t have responded.
Gimme a break.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
How is it a "dumb comment"? Please, enlighten me, o wise one.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
You know, you're right, it's a great comment. One of your best.
What should we talk about next? Injuries that might hurt our star players? Kid’s failing out of school and not being able to play?
I’ve heard certain kids on the team had a hard time with grades in high school, should we discuss how that might hurt their playing and draft potential?
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
Actually no, you were right all along. Condescension and arrogance and dismissal of other people's dissent as "dumb comments" is an extremely effective and rational debate tactic.
I’m glad that there’s no attrition in college football and that we can easily predict the draft prospects of 20 year-olds a whole year before they’re even faced with the decision.
I also wish that my dad was as cool as you, because he’s such a stick in the mud that he would say that me getting a misdemeanor constitutes having been in trouble! What a curmudgeon, right?
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
I don't get why you jumped to "he might fuck up off the field"
Was it because of the misdemeanor in high school (I hope you’ve never gotten a traffic ticket… cause otherwise, you’re a trouble maker too, and your dad might have reservations about your ability to finish college)?
People are talking about draft prospects for one of Oregon’s top players and your initial reaction is “unless he fucks up.” Because we’re not supposed to take our stars for granted and we needed to be reminded of that? When have Oregon fans, more less, Oregon fans on this site EVER taken their stars for granted? We never panic right? We just assume that we’ll get a ton more stars, and that the Cliff Harris’, Dennis Dixons, Haloti Nagatas and LMJs of the world come naturally.
Like we needed your insightful comment to remind us that one of our stars just might jeopardize his potential… in a post about Kiko no less.
That would be like me writing a post about the QB battle between Costa and Thomas last year and someone chimes in with, “unless Costa injures himself and can’t play.” Yeah, no shit, thanks for enlightening us. You mean someone’s chances of playing might actually be effected by them screwing up off the field or injuring themselves? Really? WOW, that’s incredibly useful information!
Or maybe you were inferring something about Harris specifically. Like he’s prone to screw up off the field. So I ask, what’s your point? And you come back with we shouldn’t take our stars for granted and Harris is known to screw up. And then you link to an article about a high school misdemeanor that isn’t even on his record to date.
So again, what’s your point? That in the discussion of Harris’ potential, we might actually need to discuss the very real possibility that he might screw up and risk all of that. Ok. Good to have the dissenting view. Unreasonable and as unlikely as it may be.
Dissenting opinion is one thing. Stating the obvious and inferring something else is completely different.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
Nope.
That would be like me writing a post about the QB battle between Costa and Thomas last year and someone chimes in with, "unless Costa injures himself and can’t play." Yeah, no shit, thanks for enlightening us.
No, that would not be it. It’d be like you writing a post on Costa and Thomas in which you conclude that “There is no doubt that Nate Costa will be our quarterback this time next year. Book it right now,” and someone replying “Unless of course Nate Costa gets injured.” Of course it, to some extent, is an obvious factor, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t worth noting or at least considering. You acted from the start like you were taking it personally that I would even think to suggest a thing such as Cliff Harris making a mistake in his life off the field that would prevent him from realizing his draft potential that many are projecting far too early.
So, sorry, I guess, for ruining your little fantasy narrative there. Your misrepresentation of my point was juvenile, and deeming my comments — in which you were clearly offended by me questioning the character of your favorite player — “dumb” was, frankly, quite low.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
I'm glad you know what I take personally. What else is there "O wise one?"
Either example, you still made a no shit Sherlock statement and were called out to explain it and the only thing I’ve seen taken personal is the fact that your comment was even questioned in the first place.
You made a “no duh” comment. And when called to explain it used shoty evidence and more “no duh” reasons to substantiate it.
If you had said, “Unless he gets injured and has to sit out a bunch this year.” it would have had the same substance to it. Or “Unless he fails schools and can’t play.” It was still obvious and devoid of content and I still would have questioned it.
As for the whole take it personal, golden boy and o wise one comments. It seems that I’m not really the one having a problem with this discussion. I haven’t had a problem when people have called Harris out on many other things. Your no duh comments made me question it. Just as it would had you said the same thing about Thomas, James, Costa’s injuries, etc.
And no, I didn’t make a declaration in my post that no one else was going to get caught for off field problems. You just decided to interject in a post about someone hurting the team with off field troubles a dumb comment about how off field troubles might hurt a player.
Well, no duh.
P.S. Maybe I’ve just come to expect more out of your comments as a respected member on this site. I wasn’t expecting you to state the obvious and then try and defend it with more obvious reasoning and weak evidence.
If I offended you with my callous response, I apologize. I’ve just felt this is one of your weakest and “dumbest” assertions.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
I didn't think citing sources to back up my point that he has in fact been in trouble because he was charged with a misdemeanor...
… would qualify as “shoty [sic] evidence.” I’m not sure what other evidence one would need to conclude that a kid has been in trouble with the law once in his life.
Sorry about this getting so heated.
THE GENTLEMAN WILL SIT! THE GENTLEMAN IS CORRECT IN SITTING!
For the record!
For the record! Cliff pleaded no contest to the misdemeanor to allow him to get to Uof O in time to participate in training camp! Not because he wouldn’t have been exonerrated of the charges had it gone to trial. The earliest trail date available was in late September and it would have denied any possibility of getting to school in time to particpate and prepare. Cliff felt there was an opportunity to play in his first season and after carefull consideration and the weighing of the the options available, the decision was made to enter the plea! There you have it from the ultimate insider!
Cu2hard
For the record!
Cliff pleaded no contest to the misdemeanor to allow him to get to Uof O in time to participate in training camp! Not because he wouldn’t have been exonerrated of the charges had it gone to trial. The earliest trail date available was in late September and it would have denied any possibility of getting to school in time to particpate and prepare. Cliff felt there was an opportunity to play in his first season and after carefull consideration and the weighing of the the options available, the decision was made to enter the plea! There you have from the ultimate insider!
Cu2hard
I think the bottom line is that the LB group is a lot like the WR group
We’re going to need one or two of the incoming freshmen to contribute. I think Wallace and Hardrick will surprise us by earning quite a bit of time next fall, but for now, I think switching Kaddu to Will, putting Clay at Mike, and Lokombo at Sam might be the best situation for the beginning of the season. The nice thing is that quite a few our backers can play different spots, so that helps us. We will need that kind of flexibility.
Prince: This bores me. Is anyone up for a game of basketball?
Dont discount Rahim Cassell,
The Florida commit that never was
Self anointed President of the Kenjon Barner fan club.
I honestly would rather see BoLo at WILL and the Bigger Kaddu at SAM
but that’s just me.
The "Bill Simmons" of ATQ
If we're going to shuffle
I’d leave BoLo at SAM, Clay at WILL and move Kaddu to MIKE, much like this play except with Kaddu in for Matthews at the MIKE position
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
I just feel like Kaddu and BoLo on the edges is too fast a duo to have one of them "stuck" in the middle.
The "Bill Simmons" of ATQ
And I’d rather have experience and understanding of what the front 7 wants to accomplish along with size up the middle. I’d love it if every game teams thought they had to get to the edges against our defense to get yards because they weren’t going to be able to pound it up the middle.
Constantly making Daisy cry
The Daily Faberian
I don't think we're going to have the "experience" that we'd like from our defensive general regardless of who's in there.
The "Bill Simmons" of ATQ
He's going to be the "Darron Thomas Project" this year IMO
He’s certainly got the athletic ability, but does he have the system down enough to run the show?
(Basically the same questions about DT last year)
The "Bill Simmons" of ATQ
I am actually way more fearful about the WR group...
believe it or not. WR in our scheme is almost impossible to get the first year yet we’ve managed to get a couple of backers some meaninful playing time the last few seasons in Clay and Alonso. Coleman and Malone have made some plays this spring. Yet no WR seems to be establishing themselves. Sorry, but having what appeared to be a project recruit in Dungy surface as the most reliable is making me nervous. Our saving grace is that we will be running a lot of 2 WR sets and that Barner, Lyerla, Paulson, Williams can all step up and catch the ball for us. However, I would like it when this offense can actually stretch a team vertically.
Juju is the same yesterday and today and forever.
At least one will.
Laying a blanket over all of them is a stretch.
Fuck you, Juju. We'll do it ourselves.
by BigGreenWreckingMachine on May 5, 2011 11:03 AM PDT up reply actions
I'll bet you cash money that at least two newcomer WRs/TEs see the field ON OFFENSE against LSU
The "Bill Simmons" of ATQ

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![My apologies for spamming the ATQ with comments where I included this link. Here it is, in the proper location on the blog, the 2010 Oregon Ducks Football Year In Review Highlights with soundtrack. Highlights from throughout the year, some telling stats in the credits. Getting good feedback on YouTube. Cheers.
[Mod Update]:Link fixed.](http://cdn2.sbnation.com/fan_shot_images/167614/2_small.jpg)













